Introduction

Beth 1:12

Hey everyone. This is Beth. And I'm Jeff. And this is your enneagram coach, the podcast. We're here to help you to understand yourselves with astonishing clarity so that you can break free from self condemnation, fear, and shame by knowing and experiencing the unconditional love, forgiveness, and freedom and Christ. Well, if you didn't know, guess what? We're on YouTube, so head over there. You can watch this podcast, but we hope that you'll like it and subscribe so you don't miss any new content that we.

Jeff 1:41

Hey, today we're gonna be talking about type sevens wings, which are type six and eight. If the concept of wings is new to you, we suggest going and heading back to listen to one episode, one 60, but we explain what the enneagram wings are in more

Enneagram 7 wing 6

Jeff 1:55

detail.

Beth 1:55

okay, so let's move into Healthy six and kind of like get a feel for what sixes are. I

Jeff 2:02

appreciate this cuz uh, you're gonna spend a moment talking about me at my best. Yes. Thank you. So just tell me how

Beth 2:08

great I am. I'll tell you. Okay, great. Okay. So people, um, might be surprised that your sevens, um, have a six wing because sevens are the most spontaneous, optimistic, they're ready to go for all the experiences. They're not gonna hold. Well, that doesn't feel safe for the six part of their heart because six is, they have the fear of fear itself being without support, guidance, security. They fear being blamed, targeted alone, and physically abandoned. But they desire to have security, guidance and support. So one thing to know about six is it's, is that they're very reliable, trustworthy, and they're great troubleshoot. And when you kind of see that in combination with the seven, it's remarkable because sevens sometimes aren't as reliable. Mm-hmm. Because they're always bouncing from one thing to the other. But when they bring that, uh, six wing into them, it really is remarkable cuz they're gonna be fun and reliable. They're going to bring up new possibilities, but trustworthy at the same time. And sevens and sixes, man, they are fast thinkers and they can adjust, um, at any moment. With this troubleshooting mentality, but with the seven in the lead, they're gonna be more positive about it versus more fearful. Um, also the sixes bring a sense of commitment, loyalty, and being a very faithful friend. Um, and so. Just realize that the sixes, the underlying everything is this anxiety of, well, what could happen? And, but the sevens are gonna bring more of a positive spin to it. So what you're gonna see with the healthy six is, oh, I have the courage to actually go and do. And even though I see some of these hindrances, it's gonna be okay. Let's take the courage, the courageous step to move forward. So I'd love to hear from you guys how has the six, the committed, the faithful, the dutiful, um, helped ground your type seven while also still being fun and excitable, trying new things, um, in, in all areas of life. What, how has this affected you guys?

Melissa 4:13

Or actually even just as you were talking Beth, I was like, oh, maybe that's also another part of my six wing. So I'm like constantly even having like I'm introducing myself to new, the parts of my part six all the time. And one of the parts of seven that I didn't always resonate with was that kind of, that like fear of commitment. And you know, I think like I got married pretty young. I've had friends that are lifelong friends. Uh, I, I don't make a great employee, but I committed to running a business, you know, different things like that. And so I'm like, oh, that maybe that was a six coming out. So six things. I also think it's the part, um, that. You know, even though it took us almost 20 years, like finally got us to do like our estate planning, cuz you know, when people talk about like the reasons why you should do such things, like I'm, it's very easy for me to buy into all of that, to all the things that could happen if in fact something happens to you and you don't have those things in place. You know? And so that, things like that, I'm very easily sold to, I think through that

Beth 5:14

fear mechanism. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. Uh, Marty, what about.

Marty 5:20

Yeah, I, I really, I really love the six swinging. I'm not gonna lie. I feel like it, it just keeps you outta trouble at times. It can be kind of like a warning sign of like, Hey, that may not be a good idea,

Jeff 5:31

or, Hey, it's interesting, I have a strong seven wing, I call him El McCordo uh, he doesn't do that. He does not keep me outta trouble at all.

Beth 5:40

But it's the opposite, right? So That's right. It is the opposite. Your six part does that plenty. Um, but yeah, so Marty, I'd love to hear more. My dad is a, a seven with a very strong six wing, and I can completely see how the sixth part of his heart is that warning though. I guess he is married to a six as well, that warning system. He's welcomed. Be careful, be careful. Um, but how has it kept you outta trouble?

Marty 6:05

Yeah, it's helped me be really responsible and I think I learned at a young age, like you had to work hard to get where you wanted to go. Like school was really hard for me, like. I had a learning disability. It was not easy and probably my parents too. But that sixth side of being like, you're gonna have to work hard, you're gonna have to be responsible. Like if you're gonna get where you're gonna go, like you have to keep your stuff in line. And it sometimes when I read seven, I was like, I don't always resonate with just completely being so off the wall or spontaneous. I was like, I feel like I'm always up for a. Fun, but like comfortably safe adventure. Yeah. Like it's gonna be, that's a great way

Melissa 6:47

of

Marty 6:47

putting it. It's gonna be fun, but it's gonna be, we're gonna be safe at the same time. So it's like that they conflict a lot, but like, sure. I see them come

Beth 6:57

through. Yeah, it, it gives you that kind of, it seems like that that sweet balance between positivity and fun and being able to go out and try new things, but also being more measured so that you're not literally bouncing off the walls and not getting things done. So, yeah, that's it. It can be such a beautiful blend for sure. It's like,

Marty 7:17

The work hard, play hard mentality. Yeah. I was like, always resonate with that. It's like, you're gonna work hard and then you're gonna have fun.

Beth 7:23

Like Yeah. Oh, that's so good. That's a great way of putting it. Yeah.

7w6 in unhealth

Beth 7:26

All right, so Jeff, let's go into the less

Jeff 7:28

healthy parts. Yeah. Thanks for saving this section for me, Beth. I really appreciate it. Not that this is, you're familiar with any of this. Well, as we described the unhealthy characteristics of the wing six, remember that it does have positive intent and is trying to protect our hearts from being further wounded and it's doing its best, um, and need you to see its good intentions and to bring the message of Christ grace and healing. So an unhealthy six wing can express itself in your anxieties and securities dissatisfaction with something or someone. Hinders you from getting what you want. It can also make you suspicious of others and will test their loyalties to see if they'll meet your needs or avoid them entirely To pursue what you want, when you're preoccupied with your desires, your six wing will try to predict anything that might get in the way of obtaining them. And when you're struggling, the anxieties of your six wing can cause you to lose focus, become scattered, and even doubt yourself. So give us some examples and we'll go back to you. To start off with you and Melissa, how does your six wing maybe show up in unhealthy ways?

Melissa 8:31

Yeah, I think my f sometimes my first instinct, especially with my young adult kids, like there's something terrifying about releasing. Your kids into the world. I don't know if you've ever experienced that. Beth and Jeff. Mm-hmm.

Jeff 8:43

Yep. No, they were great. They're great. They were awesome. I never have, they work for us and I'm still concerned about their employer. I know. Um,

Melissa 8:53

so like our son, um, married, has a kid like, I mean, fully an adult and I know all of these things and is buying a house and like, didn't really loop us into the process. And so when I thought about it, like everything. All the six came out. I was like, I mean, we could have come to the home inspection. Why didn't you talk about this to mom? Like, you're young. You've never done this before. We've done this so many times. You should have asked us. Mm-hmm. What if, you know, and then it's like, what if, what if this house like, yes. Is te like, what if you waste all this money? Yeah. What if this thing happens? What about this thing in your life? Did you think about this? Like, I mean, it's just awful. And it's definitely not, it is not the mom that they want by any stretch of the imagination. And I've gotten better at having those conversations internally with myself or with my husband and a little less with them. Mm-hmm. But I mean like six wing jumps out and is like, whoa, hold, you know, like hold. Sure. You know, where's the checklist, so. Mm-hmm.

Beth 9:48

Yeah. Now,

Jeff 9:49

do you like that part of your heart?

Melissa 9:53

Um, I, it feels very inconvenient to the seven and eight parts of me. Yeah. Like, yeah. Um, I, I think I appreciate it more. I think I appreciate it, like Marty was saying, you know, in terms of responsibility and some of those things, but mm-hmm. Um, the anxiety is, Yeah, it's not great and I can like, I can almost watch it like an outside, you know, like I'm like watching it go down. I'm like, whoa, pull yourself together. Yeah.

Beth 10:18

Yeah. But it's hard cuz it's like, it, it just keeps thinking and like, cuz I go to a six when I'm under stress as a nine and it definitely like, is so convincing of all the things that could go wrong and, well, I don't want that to happen, so I must alert everyone, you know, and we have to get this in line with. The best way or the safest way possible. You

Jeff 10:39

can't handle the world

Beth 10:40

of a six can. I can't. And you, you show me all the time that I

Jeff 10:44

can, you just need to get outta my neighborhood and go back

Melissa 10:47

home to nine. Like at the same time I was trying to use the analogy of like, don't get on the roller coaster. Right? Like stay on the platform. Like

Beth 10:54

Yeah. But I think, you know, and this is what's so great about the enneagram showing healthy to unhealthy, right? We, your kids do want this part of you, but from unhealthy perspective, right? So they do want a mom that's gonna say, Hey, you're an adult, and if you would like some advice, I would love to give it to you cuz we've gone through this many a times. Here are a few like. Um, overview ideas of what could go wrong, but I, it's up to you if you ask for help or not. You know, like, are you paying the right amount? What's the interest? Could you get a better interest? Like, you know, you could say that instead of, what I would do and I'm really stressed is, oh my gosh, like, well, what about this? What about that? You know, like it just gets very etic. Scattered. Yeah, frenetic, scattered. Could you email? It's

Melissa 11:41

my contract asap, so I could go over it with a.

Beth 11:44

Toothbrush. Yes. And so it's a both and, right? So they do want this part of. Um, because I do want to know that their mom, their parents do care. Mm-hmm. And are willing to step in and protect, um, and to be reliable and trustworthy if they so choose to do it. So it's, it's giving that option. And that's what I love so much about the engram. It's like, oh, no wait. That is a great part of me if I allow it to show up in a healthy way. Well,

Jeff 12:09

and I'm curious too, Melissa, so you've got this and thinking through the lens of parenting. So there's this part of your heart that wants to. Uninhibited and to bring about fun and to enjoy your children and for them to enjoy their lives. There's another part of you that wants them to be independent. To have a strong yes and a strong no. And then there's another part of them to stay loyal, to stay connected and to trying to keep them safe. Mm-hmm. That's a lot that's going on in that mommy heart. Uh, how, how, what words would you give to express how these different parts show up in your parenting and how do you manage that?

Melissa 12:52

Yeah, I think it's all comes from just a lot of self-reflection to even see all of that. Cause I think in, you know, five years ago, I, I couldn't have even put words to like the parts of it or how it was showing up. It was like kind of probably so disorganized. But I think the other part is like going back to the core motivation, which is always so humbling, right? And I mean, it's definitely about them. Like I don't want them to go through things that, you know, like you want to protect them. But when it comes to motivation, like honestly, like it's part of, it's because I don't wanna have to deal, like with the inconvenience to me, like I don't wanna have to deal with their big feelings about. They're like, when, when it goes wrong? Like honestly this kid, this one particular kid that I'm talking about will like handle it like a champ if this, if, if they walk into a situation and five years later like that wasn't great. Like it just happened again and again where he rolls with the punches and it actually doesn't even come back to me. But we also have kids where their missteps do come back on like help and then I'm like, then I feel like, dude, we. Avoided this, like the seven in me is like, I tried to help you avoid this. Like, because I don't want to be in your pain. Yeah. Right, right. And so like this is a little bit about you and this is a lot of, bit about me. Yes. Yeah. Well,

Jeff 14:24

that's an important point about the Enneagram and parenting. Yes. A lot of parents want it to be about them. And so what, what can I type my kid and what, how do I parent them best? Mm-hmm. But the enneagram's real gift is for parents. Yeah. To understand themselves and what is showing up, because you're gonna be way more present to your child's life. Mm-hmm. Uh, with. The work of understanding your Enneagram type and all of its connecting types. Mm-hmm. Well, Marty, what about you? How does the six part of your heart, we don't wanna leave you out here and, uh, you know, talking about our unhealthiness, uh, at six, but, um, how does the six show up in your life in maybe unhealthy ways?

Melissa 15:05

Yeah.

Marty 15:06

I will say, I don't know, and you may resonate with us being an actual six, but it's that worst case scenario thinking, and it's just your mind is. Just a drier tumbling on every situation that could happen. And for the life of me, I feel like maybe cuz I'm a seven, the logic just leaves and it's like, mm-hmm. Okay. Here's 10 examples of what could go wrong. And no matter what, none of those will be what actually happens. Like I can sit and prepare as much

Jeff 15:36

as I want, but eventually it might,

Beth 15:39

six would say nothing.

Marty 15:42

What? God's funny that way, and he's not. It's not gonna be any of these that you prepared for

Beth 15:47

prepare.

Jeff 15:48

Yes. Now, what would be interesting, uh, Marty, so when you start to feel your mind starting to rev up and you know you're going down the healthy path, there's this seven part of your heart that wants to get out of the discomfort that that's bringing. So does the sick in some way serve as an activator for unhealthy part or habits of dealing with anxiety?

Melissa 16:12

Yeah, I will say

Marty 16:13

it's the seven is wanting to get out and it's like, okay, we need to think through everything as fast as possible so we can maybe try to have solutions on deck. Mm-hmm. But the six can be really insistent of just wanting you to stay in that moment while the seven's like, we gotta get out, we gotta get out. Like,

Melissa 16:31

yeah.

Marty 16:32

Right. But it's hard. I feel like it competes a lot. Yes, yes.

Beth 16:35

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, those two, um, are very much competing and, and very much in conflict. I mean, obviously when they're both healthy, they're, they're supporting one another from different vantage points. But man, when we're not healthy, it is very like an internal battle. Mm-hmm. You know, that's ensuing.

Marty 16:52

And it's almost like that's when I would, oh, sorry.

Beth 16:55

Sorry. No, no. Go for it. I was gonna say, that's when I could

Marty 16:57

turn to the like consumerism of the seven. Like, oh, let's just go get something fun to eat. Let's just go get some something fun to drink. Let's go talk to a friend. Let's get a distraction in place as fast as possible. But the six is still nagging, like, Hey, you're

Beth 17:11

not three of this yet. Yeah.

Jeff 17:15

It is being loyal. Yeah,

Beth 17:17

exactly. Well, and I, and I think that's what you guys keep saying, is to be able to, to step back or step out and observe, you know, yourself, you know, like what's happening really allows all of us to regulate our inner world better. And by being able to regulate those emotions and thoughts and behaviors, it allows us to. Have a more fulfilling life that which isn't necessarily happy, right? Happy is one thing, but to enjoy life. To see the richness of life, to be able to wade through the ups and the downs, and when we're able to take a step out and go, you know what, yeah, this is a hard season, or, oh yeah, those things could go wrong, but if we're allowing ourselves to be in a healthier place, then when the six does say, You know, something bad could happen here that can actually be a really good thing for a seven. Like, oh yeah, maybe I should slow down a little bit, or maybe I should pivot a little bit more to be more loyal or committed, whatever it is. So, I think it's really good for us to be able to have this vocabulary of the different parts within us so that we can bring in the healthier aspect of, for you guys, the eight and bring in the healthier aspects of the six to balance out the beautiful, um, qualities of the seven, having

Jeff 18:37

so much experience being. With thickness. Um, I will say one of the ways that has profited me the most is giving attention to that part of my heart. So it's not turning away or trying to distract, but it's turning towards. And one of the images that comes to mind, um, I forgot, what's the name of that alien movie? Well, there's a lot of 'em. Um, with Mel Gibson. Oh. Signs? Signs. And at the end of that movie, um, the son who has asthma mm-hmm. But he gets sprayed by one of the aliens and they're going to have to work through this without medication. And he grabs his son and puts him near to his chest and he says, breathe with me. And there is a part of this childlike six part of our heart that. Wants peace. It's trying its best in its own way. But there, I think there is a way that kind of like the, the, the highest healthiness of a seven that can sit in the midst of sorrow, but do so with joy. Mm-hmm. To experience the kind of dialectic of life of, you know, that it's better to be, um, mourning, uh, than at the party. Yeah. But there's an opportunity for the seven heart to sit with the six. It's not going to consume. It doesn't have that much energy, but if we attune, all of a sudden we start to realize it'll calm down and breathe to our rhythm.

Beth 20:07

Yeah. And as we kind of talk about bringing the two sides together, because we're, we're also talking about the eight. So in order to observe these parts, we actually have to slow down. And that's sometimes an impossible task for not just the seven, but for the eight and the six. So the seven that's sitting right there in the middle. That can be really tricky. And so taking time to be still to journal, to process, you know, however it works good. You know, for people, sometimes it's a walk, sometimes it's actually journaling or maybe even speaking into your phone on a memo. You know, maybe writing isn't fun. Whatever is fun. But also, Bringing to mind what's going on and to reflect. The biggest thing for sevens is all about savoring the present moment. So anytime that you can be in the present moment and having gratitude, so much is gonna come and so much is gonna spill forth from that place. Is that, do you guys find that to be true? Definitely. What are some things that have helped you to kind of get to that space?

Marty 21:11

I think it's, The anxiety of the six and then the intensity urgency of the eight. I think that can cause some of that impulsiveness of the seventh. Mm-hmm. To like hurry and act and like get through it fast. But I think being able to notice it and say, okay, committee, like you need to, you're not right. You don't know everything like. You're okay and telling the eight to calm down, but also to be like, I am good where I'm at, and just kind of like listing reasons why I am grateful for what I have right now. Yeah. Even if something bad were to happen, like just kind of taking a minute to slow everything down and be okay if I can't solve it within even 24.

Beth 21:57

Yeah, just so, and what is the difference, do you think, because reframing is the defense of mechanism. What is the difference between reframing and bringing kind of a, a sober reality, uh, like a, a mindfulness and savoring the moment? What, what do you think the difference really is there?

Marty 22:17

I mean, I feel like the reframing is sometimes it's like grandiose. It's like mm-hmm. Too fluffy. But then that piece of being like, I am stressed. Mm-hmm. But I'm also thankful for what I have. Mm. And being as real as you can, and maybe like write down tangible things that you're thankful for and not just being like lofty

Beth 22:40

with it, if that makes sense. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Sounds like you're like, maybe it's just more grounded and authentic of both the highs and the lows and being able to see through all of it versus just looking at the positive. Would that be true? Yeah. Yes. Okay. Absolut. Melissa, what about you?

Melissa 22:57

Yeah, I think yoga has been really helpful for me because it's moving. Mm-hmm. So it doesn't require like stillness, stillness, but it's kind of this like grounded, more intentional movement. And then as I practice that more, I was able to add a practice of centering prayer, which kind of also looks like meditation. So like stillness, silence. And I think that. Helps quiet the unhealthy parts of the six, right? Because there's this like, rest of, like, you can rest in God's providence, like you can be still. Um, sometimes it invites the healthy parts of six because it, it requires you to slow down. And so sometimes ideas and things that the seven and eight are running with, in times of that kind of stillness, I'm able. Wrap my head around, oh, like what are the things you should be thinking about? Like why, why might this not be a great idea? Or what are the parts that you have to consider to continue to make it a great idea? Um, and yeah, so I think those two things. And then in terms of like that balance of reframing, I. Writing. So I'm not a huge journaler like, and certainly not like a super emotional feelings triad, journaler. But, um, one I gratitude journaling didn't do it for me because I think sevens are naturally grateful. And so it's, it's almost like too easy to have a gratitude journal. You're like, oh, what am I grateful for? Like, here's all the things, but writing down things that have happened in that day, almost just like a running tally and forcing myself to write down things. Were neutral or not great and recognizing that they happened in the midst of all the good, because sometimes it's easy in the reframing when you go to reflect on a day a seven's like, oh, the day was great. And like all the good things come out. Like you can literally tell this tale of any day in like two ways. Like, you know, from like, Uh, you know, the half empty or the half full. And so I would tell it to myself and journal it and record it like it was all great. And the thing is, is it's not right, like mm-hmm. And so it's not that I don't want to be able to be grateful for the things, but it's. Also, you know, like there were whole Psalms in the Yeah. About lament. You know, like we also have, we can't not recognize that something disappointing happened or I had a feeling, like, a sad feeling about that, or a disappointed feeling or a, you know, a hurt feeling. And so to just even recognize that those things happened, uh, has been a really important practice, I think. Well,

Beth 25:44

it sounds. Like when you're describing that, it feels like I'm almost watching the movie Inside Out, you know? Cuz Joy is like this quintessential type seven and she's trying so hard, the whole movie to get rid of sadness, you know? And then at the end of the movie, what you see is them coming together and embracing both the joy and the sorrow of life and how it brings so much richness and beauty and depth. And so that's really kinda what I'm hearing from you. It's not like you said, yeah, sevens can definitely be positive, but you're, you're saying, no, let's go deeper and richer in the moment. And I love how you're entwining the reality of the day. Um, because it's not just about reframing, it's about experiencing all of life together. Yeah, all my

Melissa 26:32

really good days, I try to like put a feelings word with those things too, and I have to like get an actual feelings wheel out to do it. Yeah. Here we go. Yeah.

Marty 26:41

Yeah. Great. I also also think it's really funny that you said yoga because yoga was also something I got into to like calm things down and it, it really did work. I think there's something there with that, like your body's moving, but your mind is getting hushed and so I just thought it was so funny that you also said, That's just like a funny, like I, and it was hard for me to like doing it at first, like it wasn't fun at

Melissa 27:03

first, but it helped. Well, the eight wing told me to go to like level two hot yoga. So it can't just be like regular yoga.

Marty 27:10

Right, exactly. I didn't read the fine print and ended up in hot yoga and was dying because I was too busy just signing up and didn't know what I, that's funny.

Beth 27:19

That's hilarious. That's awesome.

Jeff 27:21

Well, Melissa and Marty, thank you so much. For showing up with every bit of who you are. Uh, and it, it's such a gift, not only to us, but also to all of our listeners. So thank you so much. Um, Melissa, where can people find out more about your coaching?

Melissa 27:37

So you can find us@theadoptionconnection.com. Uh, we're post adoption resources on Instagram. Um, so yeah, all

Jeff 27:44

the places. Fantastic. And Marty, about yourself. Where can people find.

Marty 27:49

Yeah. Yeah. So I am of course on the Y U C directory, you search. Just Marty, my first name, I'll come up, but also any Graham coach Marty on both Instagram and TikTok.

Find a coach

Beth 28:00

That's awesome. And just to let people know that that is myenneagramcoach.com, and then just type in Marty and you'll see her there.

Jeff 28:08

Well remember, if you're interested in learning more about the enneagram, head on over to yourenneagramcoach.com. If you wanna take it further, be sure to head over to my enneagram coach.com where you can find hundreds of coaches around the world, uh, that can help you to take you to the healthy places that you desire.

Become an Enneagram Coach

Jeff 28:22

And for those of you who want to bless others by becoming a certified Enneagram coach, be sure to check out our uh, leading certification program at yourenneagramcoach.com/BEC stands for becoming an Enneagram co

Beth 28:34

coach. Yeah, and as always, remember that the Enneagram reveals your need for Jesus, not your need to work harder because it is the gospel that transforms us. Thank you guys so much for joining with us today, and the next episode we'll talk about type eights and their wings.