Introduction

Beth 1:11

Hey everyone. I'm Beth. And I'm Jeff. And this is your Your Enneagram Coach, the podcast. And we're here to help you to understand yourselves with astonishing clarity so that you can break free from self-condemnation, fear, and shame by knowing and experiencing the unconditional love, forgiveness, and freedom in Christ. And if you didn't know, we are on YouTube. So you can head over there, watch this podcast and definitely like and subscribe so you don't miss anything.

Jeff 1:36

Well, today we're gonna be talking about the type eights wings, uh, which are seven and nine. If the concept of wings is new to you, we suggest going back to episode one 60, where we explain Enneagram wings in more detail. But essentially, wings are the two types directly next to your main type on the Enneagram symbol. So for example, I am a six, and so my wings are five and seven, and Beth here is a type nine. And so her wings are type.

Beth 2:04

Yeah, exactly. So today we get the privilege of having two guests that are both type eights and we get to hear about their seven wing and their nine wing. But don't forget that it's their main type that is the driving force behind their thoughts, feelings, and behaviors based on their core motivations, which is their core fear, desire, weakness, and longing. But the wings play a significant role because they have their own perspective from their core motivations, and so they see and interpret the world in their own way, and they wanna influence your main type. To see it their way and do it their way. And so today we get to talk about how these wings do influence us both in healthy and unhealthy

Jeff 2:46

ways. Well, and because we actually have relationships with these two parts of our life and they show up in small ways as well as big ways. And so we'll be referring to wings as parts of us, which we discuss more in our newest book, more than Your Number. You'll wanna check it out, uh, because it's gonna go deep into understanding wings and how they play a role in our lives, particularly expressed through the lens of our main type. Now, talking about your wings as parts might seem a little strange at first, but uh, we actually already speak this way without even realizing it. Uh, when we're talking with others, we can feel pulled in different directions in our thoughts and our feelings and behaviors. So you may say things like, well, a part of me wants to do this. A part of me wants to do this. Part of me feels this way, but a part of me feels this way. Mm-hmm. Or, if you've been married longer than a honeymoon, how you can feel both love and anger for your spouse. spouse all that one time what? I've never been angry with you. I know. I mean, how could you ever be angry with a nine? How could you? Right. Exactly. Because they never do anything wrong. Right. And they're the sweetest

Beth 3:43

things. Right. And Yeah. Until they're not. Wait, what?

Jeff 3:51

But remember this, that both our main type is driven by our core motivations and these wings being bring their own perspectives through the lens of their core motivations that can actually bring up contradict, contradicting thoughts and uh, feelings. Mm-hmm. So, as we talk about type eight's wings with our guests who we're gonna introduce here in a minute, but keep in mind that they always remain a type eight mm-hmm. With the core motivations of a type eight. And that's gonna be leading the way. But what you'll hear today is how in certain situations, in relationships, their nine wing and their seven wing parts will show up in influence their thoughts and behaviors in both healthy and unhealthy

Beth 4:29

way.

Enneagram Type 8 Summary

Beth 4:29

That's right. So, uh, but before we introduce our guest, I just wanna paint a picture of the type eights for those that either aren't familiar or you just need a refresher. Our type eights, we call them the passionate protectors. They are confident, decisive, and assertive leaders. They are powerful change agents, and especially when they're seeking justice or the protection of others. Now, if you have an eight in your life, you're gonna know because you're gonna feel the protection that they offer, uh, to those that are marginalized, the underdogs, those who are, um, at the mercy of injustice, and they want to empower those that they know have so much to offer the world. Now, of course, eights don't always focus on others, and what you'll notice is they have intense emotions and an intense drive to protect themselves from betrayal, powerlessness, and being blindsided. And they always have usually this strong exterior for others to see because they're trying to minimize their vulnerability in the front of others. Um, now they fear being weak and vulnerable, but what you can see that comes outward from that is times of being maybe too blunt, confrontational, insensitive, domineering, cynical, and even vengeful. Now, all of these attributes, the healthy and all, the way to the unhealthy stem from their core motivations. So for them, their core fear is the fear of being weak, powerless, harmed, controlled, vulnerable, manipulated, and left at the mercy of injustice. Now they desire to protect themselves and those in their small inner circle. Now they have a core weakness of lust or excess, and this is where they're constantly desiring intensity and control power, pushing themselves willfully in life, and even through people to get what they want. Now, their core longing is to hear you will not be betrayed. So you can think of eights. This is my favorite analogy as those big strong diesel snowplows up in the north, um, that we're accustomed to. Or if you're, if you're not and you're down in the south, you know what I'm talking about. When you look at, uh, the weather channel, we absolutely need these big diesel snowplows. When there's a foot of snow on the highway or any road for that matter, you can't just get out there with a little shovel. We need these powerful change agents to plow a path for us. It is inspiring to watch an eight do what they are made to do, and that is to take on the hits and to plow a path for others. So when they're at their healthiest, that is exactly what they're doing. They're plowing a path for us.

Meet Type 8s Wilson and Stacey

Jeff 7:04

So our guests today are Stacy and Wilson. Uh, yeah, Wilson. Sorry I don't put another syllable in your name. Um, who are both certified enneagram coaches here at Your Enneagram Coach and you can find them both in our. Uh, coaches directory by going to myenneagramcoach.com. So, Stacy, thank you so much for joining us today. Tell everybody a little bit about yourself.

Stacey 7:25

Hey, I, I'm really appreciative to be here, so thank you for the invitation. I, I told my husband I get to be on a podcast with some kind of famous people, so that that's, that's how I see you guys.

Jeff 7:38

that is awesome. we, we appreciate it, but we, we don't necessarily, we're just Beth and Jeff. Yeah. Like we, we've been working at home as empty nesters and we came up to the studio to record a pilot. Yeah. Very guys. Normal life. Yeah.

Stacey 7:52

it takes the pressure off, right? Um, so yes, I'm a certified enneagram coach and also a high, an online, high school principal and English teacher.

Beth 8:01

Ooh, fascinating.

Stacey 8:02

try to s not silently correct your grammar throughout the podcast. just kidding. I won't do that.

Beth 8:08

maybe silently though, maybe in your mind it's true.

Stacey 8:12

I've been called a grammar Nazi more than one time. Um, and I ha we have two adult children. Um, one's a um, like me. The other one is working in the fashion industry, which is really exciting. And some fun facts about me. I, we oversee a school in Uganda, um, that we're highly involved in. And, um, another fun fact, I take cold plunges every morning for five minutes and I've last few days have been having to chip it, chip it, chip through the ice with a hammer

Jeff 8:42

Yeah, that's right. Because you're actually in Canada, right?

Stacey 8:44

Mm-hmm. That's right. We're in British Columbia. I'm in a little mountain town. We've lived here for a long time. Just really love it. I'm looking out at, at my view right now, and there's trees in the glacier and It's gorgeous.

Jeff 8:57

Wow. Now, Beth, you, you tried the cold shower, not a plunge. No, not a plunge. But you were just talking about this the other day. Like you can only, you can only endure.

Beth 9:07

Yeah. I think maybe 30 seconds so far

Stacey 9:11

You have

Beth 9:11

work my way up. Yep. But five. Yeah, so you know what? She's an eight too, so she's just getting at

Jeff 9:18

it. You know, it's interesting, I, I recall now I think there were seasons. So I was an athlete in college and I had injured my back lifting weights too early. And actually I was in middle school and it plagued me throughout. Yeah, that's right. Uh, college and, but every once in a while I would jump in one of those kind of jet pull things and, but it would be filled with ice and like, that's exactly it. Yep. Like if you can get through the initial pain, like you're okay. Yeah. Yeah. You just don't want, and it's what's the limit?

Beth 9:45

It's really, by the way, Stacy,

Stacey 9:47

Uh, the limit is hypothermia, which I don't stay

Beth 9:50

which don't wanna go there,

Stacey 9:54

They say

Jeff 9:54

do they recommend like time?

Stacey 9:56

two to six minutes. And so five minutes when the, when the water temperature is, you know, 31 degrees, I think, um, five minutes. It's, it gets a little painful and you just, yeah. It you, if you start with the day something hard, then the rest of it is, you

Jeff 10:11

Yeah. Oh, that, that's

Beth 10:12

such an eight comment. Well, and it really helps

Stacey 10:15

It's, it's, it's totally an eight practice too, for sure.

Jeff 10:19

start off hard.

Beth 10:21

I'm, when's the last time you've ever as a nine? I'm like, I can't wait to get to my coffee and to get in my cozy, comfy chair in the morning blanket. But hey, I am doing the 30 seconds of really cold showers, so, hey, I'm starting somewhere. Well, that's right. You are, you're starting somewhere.

Stacey 10:36

And Beth, Beth, I do have to say after I get out the, the next best part of my day is putting on a robe and getting my coffee, and I just sit in front of the heater

Beth 10:46

go. There you

Stacey 10:47

minutes. So I've got, I've got the seven and the nine wing

Beth 10:51

Yes. Yeah.

Jeff 10:53

Oh, that's awesome. I love that. Well, Wilson's, our other guest, Wilson, thank you so much for joining us. Uh, tell us a little bit about yourself.

Wilson 11:00

Uh, Beth, Jeff and Stacy. Oh, it's an and privilege to be here. Um, yeah. And to our and listeners out there. Thanks for tuning in. Um, my name is Wilson. I'm from Cantonese and Hokkien decent so I'm part of what people call the Chinese diaspora. I'm born and bred in Atera New Zealand. also married to Esther, who's from Dutch, Polish and English descent.

Jeff 11:22

Wow.

Wilson 11:23

Malachi. Um, and I'm currently training for ordination under Tihi Me, which is also known as the Tunga Maori Anglican Church, which is

Jeff 11:32

Wow.

Wilson 11:33

expression of the, um, what you guys call the Church, something like that. Oh, see? Yeah. Yeah. Ng ordained. Um, next Sunday is deacons, which is really exciting. And I have a

Jeff 11:43

Wow.

Wilson 11:43

ministry and community development, and the enneagram has been a great tool for ministry and discipleship so yeah, I'm a eight with a dominant seven wing and a sexual type. So yeah, it's my privilege and honor to be here to chat about, um, the, enneagram and on the topic of wings,

Jeff 11:58

Yeah. Oh, I'm so glad that you're joining us, Wilson. Now tell us too, uh, how long is it you've been working on this ordination?

Wilson 12:06

probably about. Oh, about two and a half years, three

Jeff 12:10

Mm-hmm.

Beth 12:10

Yeah. Yeah, so it's a big deal.

Wilson 12:12

yeah, it's a big deal.

Jeff 12:14

Mm-hmm. That's awesome. Well, uh, congratulations and, um, I'm sure your community's thrilled to have you guys around and mm-hmm. And taking this next step in your calling. That's, uh, that's super fun. But, um, yeah. Yeah. I was just talking with a pastor friend today about just living in life in ministry and, uh, life in the local church. So it's a real gift. Well, uh, as we're gonna jump into wings today, and it's very common for people to talk about, uh, their dominant wing, which is the wing that they most notice and use most often, and many out there believe that they only have one wing, but that's actually not the case. Uh, it's not that it's, they don't have two or, or they only have one, but rather it's just one, maybe not show up as. And just as a bird has two wings. So do all of we, every number has two numbers next to it. So today we're gonna be talking about both wings and why it's important to be aware of them both, particularly for the type eight, it's the type seven and type nine parts that play a significant role in their lives. And when we discuss each, each wing, let us know if one's more dominant than the other. So we'll talk through

Beth 13:19

that as

Enneagram 8 wing 7

Beth 13:19

well. Yeah. Okay. So we're gonna dive in with, um, your type seven wing first. And again, we wanna paint the picture of the seven to see why it would be influencing you in a certain way. So the type seven's core fear is being deprived, uh, trapped in emotional pain, limited bored, missing out on something fun. And it desires to be happy, fully satisfied, and content. So what you're gonna notice with this part is that it's very excitable, it's spontaneous, it gets distracted easily. It can be impatient. Um, it can be very sociable. And outgoing. Um, and it's always anticipating future events. Like what's the next fun thing? What's the next stimulation I can have? Um, what are the possibilities that I might be missing and what can I go for? It supports your main type by really wooing others to you. Sevens are incredible networkers and connectors. They also have quick minds and they're very confident and passionate about what they want, and they, they go after it, which is very similar to an eight as well. And so when you've got the seven and the eight going at the same time, it is a force for sure. Like they both want what they want and they're gonna get it. Um, and so it's, it's good to understand how that seven can influence the eight. Now the seven wing also, you'll experience moments when they're really healthy. And from the healthy part of the seven is the seven's gonna give the eight. This abundance of radiance, grace, joy, um, they're gonna be able to be more vulnerable from this positive, optimistic heart that trust others. Um, it will be joyful, spontaneous, playful. Um, it'll be able to also make the impossible possible. Uh, seven's really what's interesting is when we talk to threes, you know, they're really fearful of failure. Mm-hmm. But when you talk to a seven, they're like, failure. What is that? It's just a new opportunity. And so they love to reframe the things that seem impossible or things that can't be fixed. They're like, yeah, we can fix it. And so that's something that the seven can also bring to the eight. So there's this enthusiasm, there's this confidence that radiates from sevens and they're very encouraging as well. So, uh, Stacy, let's start with you and then Wilson will have you chime in. But how do these healthy qualities of the type seven, uh, support you as an eight? When do they show up and what does it look like? Because it's a blend of the two.

Stacey 15:49

Mm-hmm. Yeah, they, they can look a lot like each other sometimes, actually.

Beth 15:54

Mm-hmm.

Stacey 15:54

it shows up for me, um, with the time orientation for sure. Looking forward, what's the next thing I'm looking forward to? Um, next, whether it's an adventure or. Just a trip or seeing someone that I, that I, you know, haven't seen for a while. I am constantly thinking ahead all the Um, which can get me in trouble sometimes too. Um, the other thing, seven is not my dominant wing. So I see it showing up in, um, my ability to push myself in, in hard things and not really think that it's gonna fail.

Beth 16:36

Mm-hmm.

Stacey 16:37

the eighth denial piece as well. It's like, well, what do you mean failure? Everything is gonna be fine. I, you know, I'm prepared and, and I'm doing it. Um, I can turn on my seven wing. I have to actually in social situations because I'm actually extremely introverted as an eight. Um, and so my seven Wing is the only reason I have inference.

Jeff 16:56

I'm, I'm curious, Stacey, what, what that show up like? Whenever you have to turn that on.

Stacey 17:01

It's, it's exhausting. Um, but, but people tell me you're not, you're not an introvert. There's,

Beth 17:10

Yeah. Right? Yes.

Stacey 17:13

I can, and, and I know I'm doing that. I'm like, seven, you gotta kick in for the next two hours. Um, but it is very tiring because it doesn't come as naturally as using my nine wing, which would rather be home, you know, watching Netflix under a blanket. Um,

Beth 17:28

well, and I think that's interesting. That's a, that's a really fascinating thing to point out cause I think a lot of people think. An introvert is just a quiet person, you know? So then when they see you maybe more sociable and bring a little bit of that seven energy, they're like, you can't be an introvert. And it has nothing to do with that. It has to do with how you, um, get energy and you get energy by being alone and, um, recharging without interacting with others, the extroverts out there are, are charging with others. And so I think that's a great distinction. Uh, a lot of people can get

Jeff 17:59

confused. Well, another fun thing that we've come to understand when thinking about these, uh, different connecting types as parts of us, is that other people have relationships to these parts of us. So there are people who say to you like, well, you can't be an introvert because my only experience of you is to be this very energetic, outgoing, adventuresome person. Um, but does your family or your friends have a nickname for this part of you?

Stacey 18:29

No. Not that I know of. Maybe they do, but they haven't told me.

Jeff 18:34

yeah, but like we've talked to one person, like there's like vacation mom or vacation dad that like, they just another side. Like what, when was it that your, your, spouse started to notice? Oh wow. She can turn on this other part of her personality whenever we're in public versus when maybe it's just the two of us at home.

Stacey 18:55

Yeah, well, he, he's a pretty strong five with a capital five and also introverted, so, so, um, he, I, I'm just thinking of social situations where he has said, okay, you need to, you need to turn it on, and he'll use those words and now I understand that's, I, I have language for that. like, okay, seven, here we go.

Jeff 19:21

Mm-hmm. Have you ever the seven part of your heart?

Stacey 19:23

I just call it seven for now. Yeah,

Jeff 19:26

yeah. Well that's such a great name, right? Wasn't that in, uh, no, that was 11. I was thinking of uh, stranger Things. Stranger Things. Yeah. 11 Seven's I mean, if you're an enneagram person, you know exactly what you mean when you say that.

Stacey 19:38

seven. Yeah. So a, a good example or a good story to outline that is when we, we did this big project for um, our school in Uganda and we rode our bicycles around the country for 50 days. And he said, your job if we have a mechanical or when we stop, is to engage with the people. And I will fix the bikes and do whatever here, but you need to keep them away from me. Kind of k kind of idea. Not in a mean way, but like you engage and do the social stuff and I'll do the mechanical stuff. And it was, um, it was tough. We were tired every day cuz it's a very extroverted culture and to just engage with people all day and wave and be the center of attention was, was

Jeff 20:18

Mm-hmm.

Stacey 20:18

difficult.

Jeff 20:19

Now, Stacey, you bring up a, a whole nother thing too, bringing this in the context of marriage. So your five spouse really relies on your seven wing to pick up the social responsibilities.

Stacey 20:33

Yes and no because Jeff, let me tell you, there have been many a time we'll come home and because eights are not really aware of how we come off to people a lot of the time he will say, did you notice that when you said this, that this happened? Or when someone was telling me something, they actually meant this. And I'm like, what are you talking about? I like, oh my gosh, do I need to call them and apologize? You know, so he helps me with the eight part that

Jeff 21:01

Yeah. Yeah.

Stacey 21:02

doing best in the social situation. Um, but

Jeff 21:05

I love it, but not in the moment, but after the,

Stacey 21:09

Yeah, after the moment. Well, sometimes, you know, the kick under the table,

Beth 21:12

in the moment, right?

Stacey 21:14

the table is, is an indication.

Jeff 21:17

Yeah. You mean not on a podcast where the six is being silly and the nines like, be

Beth 21:22

appropriate. Right. Give them the look.

Jeff 21:25

Oh man, the

Stacey 21:26

Yeah. We ha we do

Jeff 21:27

under the table. Yes. Well, Wilson, tell us about, uh, the healthy aspects of your seven wing,

Beth 21:34

because you use seven more often, right? Is that what you were saying?

Wilson 21:37

Yeah, it's my dominant wing, I

Beth 21:38

Okay.

Wilson 21:40

in everyday moments and just kind of the normality of things. Um, and in social settings, I'm, I'm usually stirring the pot, pushing people's buttons, winding people up, um, you know, just to create some fun, some cheekiness and just to test intimacy. And

Beth 21:54

Uhhuh.

Wilson 21:55

both deep relationships and strangers. And my humor's bit on the edge. It's sometimes dark, pushing the boundaries and by some inappropriate, like one time in high school, in class, I was playing with a ball. Um, the teacher told me to put my ball on the ground, so I moved from the table to the ground. Then she goes, Wilson, what are you doing? And I replied, you told me to put my balls on the ground. So just that sort of humor. Um, but usually people say,

Jeff 22:20

Well, that's a first on year. Enneagram Coach Podcast. Good job. You tested the boundaries.

Beth 22:28

Here we go. This, this is a perfect example of an eight with a seven wing. Perfect. That's awesome.

Wilson 22:33

So usually people say, you know, I'm the life of the party, but I don't really see it. Or when they see me on the guest list, they know it's gonna be a good time. But I

Beth 22:40

Yeah.

Stacey 22:41

Hmm.

Wilson 22:41

it is that in stirring the pot to create fun, um, as a seven with a dominant seven or as a eight with a dominant seven wing, it's the fastest way we know, um, whether we can trust the group or individual by their response the way

Beth 22:54

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 22:55

um, what, what

Beth 22:57

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 22:57

colors and what's behind their

Stacey 22:59

Hmm.

Wilson 22:59

simply by their response to the humor.

Stacey 23:01

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 23:02

about the group and their individual character, um,

Beth 23:05

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 23:06

also political views. And it shows us, you know, like, will we find common ground or mission with this person? Um, and we know so much by about a person, um, just simply by the response, the edgy duck boundary pushing sometimes inappropriate. And

Beth 23:21

Yeah, yeah,

Wilson 23:23

our humor. And that's how we kind of gauge people, I think. Um, but at our best, I think usually it's in conversation with individuals, um, you know, deep relationships or with strangers, and we're just learning about people, you know, where they're from, who they are, what's their story, when they met

Beth 23:39

yeah.

Wilson 23:39

are their dreams, what's their calling? And I, I

Beth 23:42

Super curious, right?

Wilson 23:43

Yeah, I get excited and passionate, but I think it's, it's my subtype of being a sexual eight.

Beth 23:49

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 23:50

and at my best, you know, like it's actually pushing individuals to take the next step, um, from where they are. Um, to where they want to be. It's kind of like, um, I see my role as being like a guide like Yoda guiding Luke's Skywalker and enabling people to take, you know, the next step, um, to take a risk, just to initiate something, to write a new chapter

Stacey 24:10

Hmm.

Wilson 24:11

conflict or a crisis. And usually in those conversation it's a brainstorm that's naming their tools, um, creating strategies or connecting them up with the right person or community. And often weeks, months, or years later, you know, when we bump into each other, um, they often say, you know, I took that leap and now I'm in this new

Stacey 24:28

Hmm. Mm-hmm.

Wilson 24:30

or they say, I really wrestled with what you said. Um, can we have another conversation cuz I need get my ass into gear. Um, and yeah, I think at its best it's often because eights with dominant seven wings, it's normal and natural to take wings. Oh, to take risks. Sorry. And also, like we said before, you know, we believe that failure isn't fatale. And, um, sometimes people, um, sometimes seeing is believing and people know that about us, that, you know, we take risk and we're not afraid to fail. So often those conversations about how do we take risks or how do we learn

Beth 25:03

Yeah.

Wilson 25:04

and they come just to have a chat, just to get that simple push and nudge. Um, and the hope is that, you know, us eights with seven wings, you know, we've got some sort of wisdom or practical advice to offer or simply just being a person in their corner. And sometimes it's like resources and cash, um, even the, any dream or even our networks. And I think it's because deep down we love going for the underdog. And I think that's the real gift of being an eight with a dominant seven wing.

Beth 25:31

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and I love what you're saying there, because eights really have this instinctual knowing of what others' gifts and talents and abilities are, even if the other person can't see it, and basically calling them out and putting them on the right seat of the bus. But then, like what you're saying with the seven there, it's, it brings this excitement, en enthusiast enthusiasm and encouragement as well. But it also brings in that networking component like, Hey, I might not be able to help you, but I know this other person and I want you to connect you with them. Mm-hmm. And so it's this eight that is plowing a path for other, with forward thinking movement, um, and encouragement. So I love exactly what you're painting that, that picture you're painting.

Jeff 26:12

No. Stacy, uh, while Wilson was sharing, you laughed a little bit. Uh, what was it? Do you remember what you were laughing about?

Stacey 26:20

I will do exactly that Same thing I'm gonna find out right away by, you know, and in Christian circles is doesn't take much to offend people. You know, just drop something and see who picks it up and see who le you know, like,

Jeff 26:35

It's so funny.

Stacey 26:37

humor, you know, whenever I'm on a podcast, I'm just like, so you're gonna edit this right? Because you're having eights on there and you never know what's gonna come out. Um, so I was just laughing at the familiarity of that. I, it's a good tactic. I'm guilty of using them.

Beth 26:50

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sixes can do it too. Especially counterphobic sixes. Oh, sure. Because they're, they're testing loyalty and you know, what, can I, can I trust you?

Jeff 26:58

I call that part of myself, El McCordo. Uh, it was a nickname given to me, so there's a little bit of a joke because I, I was adopted into a Scottish family who were white. But, uh, I was actually, my biologically, my mother was Mexican, my father was a Native American. And so my friends, whenever I'd get going as a pastor and say something provocative, Uh, in a small group or an a sermon, they said, oh, it's El McCordo. Mm-hmm. Kind. I'm combining Scottish and that's your seven part, um, in Spanish. And so, but Beth calls like, oh, El McCordo's in the house tonight. Huh. So, yes, he's

Beth 27:38

here, he is life of the party for sure.

Jeff 27:41

And I would associate that with my seven. That's right. Yeah, absolutely.

8w7 in Unhealth

Jeff 27:44

Yeah. Well, all the parts of our hearts can show up in. And unhealthy ways. And as we talk about the Wing sevens unhealthy characteristics, it's important to keep in mind that this part has good intentions and it's trying to help, even though it may be misaligned and it's may be inappropriate in its methods, the goal is for your good and welfare. Now, your seven wing can distract you from life's difficulties. By could be spending money on fun or exciting, uh, escape patches or other unhealthy indulgences. It can make you believe that you are the only one who's strong enough, passionate enough, and able to carry others through life's challenges. Uh, it you may make big promises and exaggerate what's possible to convince others to follow your lead. And you can be impatient, impulsive, and demanding and express what you want with little regard for how it affects. Because sevens struggle with, uh, anxiety. Your seven wing can show up as restlessness, overthinking, shortness of breath, or even tension in your chest. So we'll start back with you, Stacy. How does your seven wing show up in unhealthy ways?

Stacey 28:52

I interrupt people when they're talking on a regular basis, and I hate it. I hate that about myself. I think I read something about sevens and it's resonated with sevens that I've coached is that you assume you know what they're going to say.

Jeff 29:07

Mm.

Stacey 29:08

and so you just kind of stop listening. And I, I, I'm catching myself doing that more and more often. I'm trying to, because sevens and eights time orient orientation are both future.

Jeff 29:19

Mm-hmm.

Stacey 29:20

I'm halfway out the door before they finish their sentence because they've asked me to do something. And so it, it is a problem in every area of my life and I'm really, but I'm really becoming more aware of it, and I just have to like almost sit on my hands, so to speak, before my, my body just wants to move and jump into action. Um, so that

Jeff 29:41

it's interesting, Stacy, your disposition changed. Um, whereas when we were talking about the healthy parts of it, and this really illustrates the relationship we have to these parts, but it, my sense is you carry a lot of sadness about this part of you.

Stacey 29:56

It causes so much problem, like it causes so many problems. And I, because it's kind of a double whammy with seven and eight and you know, both on the move all the time and the confidence level,

Jeff 30:10

Mm-hmm.

Stacey 30:11

I am just, I, I have a hard time living in the present. I'm, I'm thinking, what do I have to do? And even when the person's talking, like I said, I'm thinking, what am I gonna do about this? And so you kind of stop listening. So I've been trying to practice just not even looking around, just looking right at the person and just, ah, it's excruciating sometimes to just focus and be a better listener because, People have said, I'm a really good listener, but I know, I know. The truth of that is I, I have a long ways to go in the listening and even in coaching, I have to, I have to watch how much I wanna teach and guide

Jeff 30:49

Hmm. Yeah.

Stacey 30:50

to sit and listen. So I've been listening to some of the podcasts on the listening skills and trying to hone those in a little bit.

Jeff 30:56

Yeah. Right. Now, Stacy, have anyone ever reflected back to you? Because the eight with a seven wing it, there's a lot of energy there. I, I mean, I wonder if there's a more energetic No,

Beth 31:10

there's not. Not even a mean two. A seven. A seven with an A wing. Yeah. But those, that combination is, but.

Jeff 31:19

Have you ever felt about yourself or have someone ever said to you that you're too much?

Stacey 31:26

Oh yeah, just this morning.

Jeff 31:35

I thought it might be the case, but I didn't realize it was, oh, no, that's just the water I swim in. Yeah.

Stacey 31:40

Yeah. And, and it's only in, in reference to, it's not, obviously it's not in, in reference to emotions, um, other than maybe anger, but, um, definitely speed, energy living, you know, being married to a five for so long, we've been married for 33 years. Um, our, he has access to eight and I can see a lot of eight in him. And he doesn't resemble a typical five and that he is very aware of his body is very athletic and all of those things, but he on a regular basis will say, you need, can you just slow down? You're going too fast. Like the, your, your energy is just too much. And I look at 'em, say, I don't have no idea what you're talking about. I'm just trying to help or, so we really aren't aware of that bigness, I think sometimes. Yeah.

Jeff 32:26

Well, it's interesting, Wilson, you earlier had commented on how you can, the seven part of you combined with the eight energy can bring out something great in people, but that can also at times be pushy and maybe insert of like, Hey, I didn't want to get on the boat with you, but you're like taking me along the the path now. I was, how does your seven wing show up? Maybe in unhealthy ways.

Wilson 32:51

Well, at first, I just wanna say, I think women eights definitely have it way harder than men who are eights. And it's not my

Jeff 32:58

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 32:58

to offer reflection on that or to go deeper on that. But often at my worst, I'm always go, go, go, go. I'm always running focused on the task. Um, and also like. If I don't, I can feel things just like, um, I guess stir in my gut. And like, I think it's the feeling of futility, like nothing's happening. Um, why, like, is this wasting my time?

Stacey 33:21

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 33:21

yeah. But definitely at my worst, um, someone has conflict with me or my mates, um, or it's a perceived threat to it, um, by myself to, um, to me or one of my mates, at my worst, I engage quite aggressively. also I've had many altercations as well. And of

Beth 33:41

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 33:42

Jesus, you know, and maybe a couple after following him. But in those moments, like the first thing that goes through my mind is like, what's the worst that's gonna happen? Like, getting punched, like what's the worst? Like, I'm not mad from glass. Um, however, um,

Jeff 33:57

I love that mindset, like, what's the word you're gonna get

Stacey 33:59

the worst that could happen?

Jeff 34:00

it's not the first time you've gotten hit.

Wilson 34:02

Yeah, so I think eight males often get hit all the time. Like, um, so, but what, what would surprise people more is that there've been many, there've been actually more people who have backed down and avoid altercations of me because I've got on their faces.

Stacey 34:19

Hmm.

Beth 34:20

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 34:20

there's eight, we believe the best defense is actually a better offense

Beth 34:24

Mm-hmm.

Wilson 34:25

sure that the score is settled. Um, but I think the insight behind that is that we're not afraid of conflict, especially when it's about protecting our vulnerable selves

Stacey 34:34

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Wilson 34:36

we just charge into, into conflict ready to take the person down and we will put our money where our mouth is. Um, but the interesting thing is that this really energizes us when we do that, when we protect the people that we love or put our money where our mouth is. And just the final note, that I'm so glad that Jesus has transformed me with his non-violent ways and learning

Beth 34:57

Mm.

Wilson 34:57

we're only create violence. And, you know, love is never violent. Um, and a great book called Conflict by a lady called Joyce Huggett has, has actually taught me, um, how to access, manage and engage with conflict. And it's been a helpful tool for me. Um, and it's taught ma about conflict.

Beth 35:14

Yeah. What was that book that you read? Um, it had

Jeff and Beth 35:19

a

Jeff 35:19

really weird title. Oh, I forgot the gentleman's name, but it sold millions of copies. It's called Non-Violent Communication.

Stacey 35:27

Hmm.

Jeff 35:27

I mean, it sounds like a massive top. It's such a heavy title, but the book's not that way. It's a relatively small book, but it, and it's only articulate like, what it, what did I perceive that happened? Uh, what do I feel, how did it impact me? What do I need? And then asking a person, um, to change. So, but it, it has such a provocative title, non-violent communication. Yeah.

Beth 35:54

But it was very helpful. Sure. Not just for you, but then it kind of bled into the family where we were able to have better ways of communicating with one

Jeff 36:01

another. Yeah. Well, I, I mean we, I, I wanted to try it, but probably not the best time we'd gone on a family cruise together. Yeah.

Beth 36:08

We all a family cruise. Like the fir the first day. He's like, and, and, and mind you, these were like our grown children at the time. They, I mean, they were like 18 and 16, but they were adult sized people and we were all in one room and he's like, Hey, let's try

Jeff 36:23

this. No, no, it's not. Let's try it. Is that I'm reading a book and I'm going to try and implement that. Yeah. While we're living in a closet together on a boat,

Stacey 36:33

uh, it feels like closet for

Beth 36:35

the, the rest of us just laughed at him and like, yeah, sure. And like day two

Jeff 36:38

I'm like, okay, I'm gonna try this later on. This isn't working.

Beth 36:43

Oh man.

Jeff 36:44

Well, well thank you Wilson. I really

Beth 36:45

appreciate that. Yeah.

Jeff 36:46

Well, we're so grateful for Stacy and Wilson who have joined us today. Uh, so thank you both for coming and just sharing about your life. It means so much to us, to our audience, and specifically to our types out eights out there and the people who love the eights that are in their life. And so, uh, Stacy, can you tell us, uh, where people might be able to find out more about you and, uh, your coaching services?

Stacey 37:07

Yeah, I have, uh, you can find me on the Enneagram Coach Coaches Network, so through your, through your website, and then my own website is www.freshtracksenneagram.com and my Instagram is at Fresh Tracks Enneagram.

Jeff 37:22

Great. Awesome. That's fantastic. And Wilson, what about you?

Wilson 37:25

I used to have Instagram and a website. However, uh, since I've been training for AutoNation, I've, um, stopped that. But if you wanna message me, um, I'm pretty reachable on Facebook, so just search or Chan and yeah. Um, if you got a question or want to connect, I'm, I'm up for it. And, um, yeah, keen, oh, if it's, um, I guess international. gonna say, let's grab a coffee, but I'll grab a coffee on my end. You grab a coffee on your end.

Beth 37:51

We do have, we do have lots of people in New Zealand that listen in and we have lots of, uh, or several New Zealand, uh, coaches, um, as well. So that might even be really

Jeff 37:59

fun to, yeah. For our remote team, we have coffee and connection once a month. Mm-hmm. Where, bring your favorite morning drink and we're just gonna sit around and tell stories. This morning it was highs and lows of the month of January. That's true. Yeah. Just connecting with one another. So. Well, remember, if you're interested in learning more about the Enneagram,

Learn more on our website

Jeff 38:16

you can visit us at yourenneagramcoach.com. And if you're ready to take a step further with personalized Enneagram coaching, uh, like with Stacy and Wilson, then you can head over to

Find a Coach!

Jeff 38:25

myenneagramcoach.com where you can find, uh, incredible certified coaches around the

Beth 38:30

globe. And if you're like me and Stacy and Wilson and you've experienced incredible transformation using the enneagram and you wanna pay it forward, then our certification program become an enneagram coach

Become a Coach!

Beth 38:41

is going to be right for you. And to learn more, all you gotta do is go to yourenneagramcoach.com/bec, and our team will love to walk you, uh, each step of the way through that process. Now, always remember that the Enneagram reveals your need for Jesus, not your need to work harder. It is the gospel that transforms us. Thanks for tuning in, and the next time we'll talk about type nine s and their wings.